Ep. 84: How to Navigate Mom Guilt and Still Slay as a PMU Boss Babe with PMU Artist Tammy Le of Face Amor
Mom guilt.
It's built into the job and nobody really warns you about it, right?
I am so excited about this episode because I had Tammy Le from Face Amor on it!
We're going to talk about how we navigate through mom guilt and still slay as a PMU Boss Babe.
Tammy and I talk about everything in this episode.
We talk about mom guilt, how to manage it, how to maybe avoid it, and even how to live with it.
We talk about Tammy and her life, how she got to this point, how she manages, and how her family life is (you guys, she’s an immigrant like me! How cool is that?).
I really just get to know Tammy in this episode, and you’re going to want to as well.
If there are things challenging you in your beauty business, you’re going to want to listen.
If you’re feeling guilty as a mom with a business, feeling like you don’t have enough time in the world to manage both your home and your business, you’re going to want to listen.
If you’re feeling the competition of the beauty industry (because believe me, just like we talk about in this episode, there’s a lot of it), you’re going to want to listen.
What are you waiting for? Go ahead and give the episode a listen!
Here are the episode highlights:
‣‣ [04:34] Kobe Bryant. The Black Mamba. Laker legend and Los Angeles hero. Here's where I pay tribute to him. Rest In Peace, Mamba.
‣‣ [14:54] Here's where Tammy Le enters the podcast!
‣‣ [17:57] Competition in the beauty industry is nuts. Tammy and I have both felt it, we've both experienced it, and we've both survived and learned from it. Right here is where we open up about it.
‣‣ [20:14] The interview begins! I ask Tammy what is challenging her the most at this stage of her beauty business.
‣‣ [21:03] Tammy tells us a little more about her home and family life here.
‣‣ [21:58] Mom guilt. The reason you clicked on this podcast! Here's where Tammy and I talk about navigating it in our boss babe world.
‣‣ [25:30] What is it with mom guilt?! I'm pretty sure it's innate, ingrained in us once we become mothers. I speak more to that here.
‣‣ [27:58] I wanted to get to know Tammy a little better on a personal level, so here's where I ask her about her childhood!
‣‣ [35:47] At this minute mark, I ask Tammy to fill in the blank of this question: "If you really knew me, you would know that I ____________."
‣‣ [36:15] Dreams. Everybody's got them. Secret dreams? Yes. Embarrassing dreams? YES! Here's where I ask Tammy what her secret, embarrassing dream is (it's too funny!).
‣‣ [39:25] Relationships are key. Here's where I ask Tammy how she manages her relationships with friends and family while running a popping beauty biz.
‣‣ [47:40] As always, here's where I ask Tammy, "What's your best advice for how to live a pretty rich life?" I just love her answer.
I DON'T WANT TO FEEL GUILTY AS A MOM ANYMORE! (Listen Here)
Tammy Le, everybody! Don't you just love her? You can keep up with her and all things Face Amor by following her on Instagram right here!
You can follow me, Sheila Bella, on Instagram @realsheilabella!
Here are the links that were mentioned in the podcast and more!
New Clients Consistently
Grow Your Gram
Online Course Workshop
FOR MY LISTENER BOSS BABES
You can enjoy this podcast by downloading it on iTunes here.
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FOR MY READER BOSS BABES
You can enjoy a transcript of the podcast here.
Sheila Bella:
Mom guilt. It's built into the job and nobody really warns you about it, right? I'm so excited because we have Tammy Le today from Face Amor and we're going to talk about how we navigate through mom guilt and still slay as a PMU Boss Babe. You're listening to Pretty Rich Podcast.
You're listening to the Pretty Rich Podcast where you are totally the heroine of your own story. I'm your host, Sheila Bella, and I built a seven figure PMU biz without a degree, without a fancy website or a sugar daddy. And if you and I hang out here long enough, you're going to start to believe that you can do it too, because you really can. I know you think I don't know you, but I do. I really, really do, because I am you and I believe we're all on the same journey together. My perfect job didn't exist, so I created it. The job I wanted wasn't hiring me so I skipped the line and hired myself as CEO, just like you can. So consider me your secret beauty biz BFF in case you need to be reminded that power is never given to you. You just have to take it. Are you ready, beauty boss? Let's jump in.
Hey besties, what's up? What's up? It's been a minute. I hope everybody's 2020 is going well so far. I'm just in such a good mood right now, you guys. I just got another email from one of you saying how awesome MCC has been for your business, and that's my online course. New clients consistently and if you haven't gotten on that, what are you doing with your life? This course is for people who want new clients ASAP. I'm not talking about if you want to build your business and need six months to farm. This stuff will work pretty immediately, I swear to you. And don't just take it from me. You've got to go to the website, sheilabella.com/NCC, because I posted all of your texts, a bunch of your DMs, a bunch of your comments within the course and it is so, so encouraging.
So if you still haven't been able to download the course, NCC, which stands for New Clients Consistently, you've got to change it, right? Go to sheilabella.com/NCC to check it out. Today I have the one and only Tammy Le of Face Amor. You guys are just going to fall in love with her after this episode, and especially for you moms out there, she is so sweet, so relatable. No ego whatsoever. I freaking love her and I know you will too.
Guys, this show is ranking. It's starting to rank. Oh my goodness, and I have you to thank for it. It's all of the reviews and the ratings you guys have been posting on Apple iTunes. Thank you so much. I just found out yesterday that this show, the Pretty Rich Podcast, is in the top 100 on iTunes in the business category. Pretty freaking cool for a little old immigrant like me.
You guys, if you still haven't left a review for me, I would really, really appreciate it. It's a way that you can say thank you to me and I would love to read your review live here on the air. So, I'm going to start with the review of the week from XO Serena XO and she says, "Inspiring, relatable, real. Thank you. I discovered this podcast channel a little month ago and have been totally addicted since then. Sheila is absolutely inspiring and speaks in a way that is motivating and makes you want to get out there and be your best self not only in the beauty industry but in life. She has given me so much motivation and confidence to know that I can be successful. Truly a podcast for any entrepreneur of any kind. It's relatable to any profession and any type of life." This meant so much to me, Serena. Thank you so much.
I really, really appreciate these reviews because it helps this podcast rank and it helps it get discovered by more people so I can keep doing it. Before we get to today's pretty awesome guest, I just wanted to quickly pay tribute to Kobe Bryant. I don't know why, you guys. I feel like this one is hitting me really hard and I didn't even expect it to. First of all, I wouldn't consider myself a basketball fanatic or a sports fanatic but about 15 years ago or so during his prime ... Was that his prime? Yeah, I guess so. I'm Filipino and Filipinos love the Lakers, you know what I'm saying?
I remember, this was about the time where I was kind of like a shell of myself. I knew there was depth in me, I just hadn't accessed it yet and we would sit around as a family ... It was like the closest thing to family bonding that I guess we had. We'd sit around as a family, me, my mom, my aunt, my cousins, and ... oh, my ex-husband too, and we would root for Kobe Bryant, and it was a lot of fun. And I was into it. I was into it not necessarily because this ball is going in this basket. I wasn't really into that, but there was a certain level of depth to basketball. It was the mentality that he brought to the court. I was into the story that he told on that basketball court. He brought it with a story, and when he won, when he won, you felt it. I felt like it was my win.
And at the time, I wasn't reading yet. Podcasts weren't a thing yet. I wasn't into self development. I hadn't built my business yet, but when I saw him and he lit up something in me, he made me feel electric ... You know whenever that happens, whenever you see another woman or somebody who's inspirational, that when you watch them, you're just like, "Oh, oh my gosh, that was so inspiring." You know what that is? That is a reflection of something that's inside you that needs to come alive, that needs to come out. It hasn't come out yet but you watching somebody else kill it or do something super inspiring, the only reason why it's inspiring is because it's inside of you. You, your highest self, that thing that you see in Beyonce or Kobe Bryant, that wants to come out. That's what that means.
And at the time I didn't know that. All I knew was that this guy had something that I wanted to access in myself, and it was his commitment to excellence. He always talked about how competition is an opportunity, competition makes you better, and the thing that I loved, I loved about Kobe Bryant most, and I didn't even know I was learning a life lesson back then when I was watching him do this, the thing that I loved about him most was that he wanted the ball. A lot of people say he hogs the ball. Of course. Of course, if you know that you're the best person to save the day, why wouldn't you want the ball? Every time the game was on the line, my whole family would shout at the TV, shout at the TV, "Give Kobe the ball! Give Kobe the ball!" And he wanted it.
It's such a metaphor for life. These days when things fall apart, when it's a tough season, when it's a hard time, most people nowadays want to pass off responsibility. They're like, "Hands off, I don't want this. Give it to someone else." But not Kobe. When the game was on the line, he said, "Give it to me. Give it to me, I'll handle it." I wanted to feel like that about something, right? At the time, I didn't feel that way about anything and now this is what I teach my children. This is what I preach. It's taking responsibility, is the anecdote, is the anecdote to suffering. It's the anecdote to sadness. It's the anecdote to pain. When you take on responsibility, you're taking on meaning. In the face of tragedy, your aim should be to take on as much responsibility as you can bear and your aim should be the most dependable person, the most dependable person in the midst of that tragedy.
I'm not saying the person that's not mourning. That's not what I'm saying. But the most dependable. The person that can take the ball. Thank you, Kobe Bryant. Didn't even know it, didn't even know who I was, but because of his life, in probably my early stages, in my formative stages, when I was just starting to think about entrepreneurship and being my own boss, he planted a thought in my head and that thought was, "I could be great. I could be great." And he did it just by being great himself. Do you guys see what I'm saying? When you achieve your dreams, when you're doing something you love and other people see it, what you're doing is you're giving people the permission to think bigger and to do the same for themselves. And I hope that's what you guys see in me.
I think this program, my platform would be an absolute failure if you didn't get that from me. I want you to know that you can dream bigger, you can achieve way higher than what you're probably thinking for 2020. I want you to know that you can quadruple that, you can 10X that, because I did. Because I did, little old me who never thought that she would ever sell out an event. I thought this event was going to be like 20 people, 20, 30 people. I had to increase the ballroom size because I realized that it was going to be a lot bigger than it was. I never thought I would be a six figure earner. I thought that I was going to be working at the MAC counter forever, and not only did I build a seven figure beauty brand, I help other women do the same and I never expected this.
It's funny what happens when you allow yourself to think bigger. It's funny what happens when you ignore limits. When you ignore limits and you act like it's just a done deal, it's just a done deal, I'm just going to keep slaying because I know this is possible. I'm just going to keep grinding because I know inevitably I'm going to hit that goal and exceed that goal. This is my destiny. What ends up happening is you exceed all expectations including your own. So this 2020, you guys, no limits. Don't think about the limits.
I have to say, ironically enough the thing that I think contributed to my success was my naivete to limits. Call me stupid, find. I was too stupid to know that failure was around the corner. I didn't know how high I was flying. When you're just laser focused and you don't look down at the height that the tightrope is at, you get across. That's how you win. That's how you get across. Keep walking and don't let anybody to tell you to look down, even yourself. Even your own negative self talk is going to tell you to stop. Look down. It's dangerous. Who do you think you are? What do you think you're doing?
Believe me, I go through this every day. You just got to drown it out and keep moving. You'll never be able to fully drown it out, just know that. So if you still have those thoughts, know that that's normal and that's probably never going to go away. You just need to learn how to keep moving and ignore it.
Guys, hug your loved ones. Hug your loved ones and not even because life is short. How about just hug your loved ones just because? Just because? But especially now. The only thing that we're promised is God's presence. We're not promised tomorrow. We're not promised anything, but he promised us that he'll be there. Yeah. So yeah. Hug your loved ones just because they're awesome.
Guys, I hope to meet you guys at the Pretty Ambitious Summit. We just announced a couple of weeks ago that we just sold out. We sold out 350 seats and I'm just so, so excited. I am in shock. I'm in shock. I'm in disbelief. I truly, truly think that there's not going to be another event like this. I'm sure people are going to try but it'll never be duplicated. It's the very first event for our industry of its kind, and you guys are making it happen. You're part of a movement, truly, and if you missed out on the Pretty Ambitious Summit this year, you've got to get on the wait list in case tickets free up. Just go to PrettyAmbitiousSummit.com. Get on the wait list. You never know, and I hope to meet you if not this year, maybe next year. But this year's going to be pretty sick, so I hope to meet you there.
And you know who you are going to meet there is Tammy. Tammy our guest for today from Face Amor. She's incredible, you guys, and we chat all things about mom guilt and how to still kill it in your biz and build your beauty brand and still do all the things, and sometimes we don't have all the answers. Duh, of course not. But it was just really nice to chat with her about the different perspectives that she had, and it's crazy because we live several miles away but our lives are very similar. We both had our kids' assembly on this day. I was like, "Your kid has an assembly? My kid has an assembly." And then she had clients and then I had clients. We're all the same, you guys. We really got to hug it out. We really got to hug it out. So here's today's episode with Tammy Le.
What's up, you guys? Welcome to Pretty Rich Podcast. Today I have Tammy Le of Amor by Tammy and Face Amor Beauty Studio and Academy in Canada. She has been in the industry now for seven years, in the PMU industry for seven years but in the beauty industry for 13 years. She has done thousands of faces and today she is going to tell us her story. Hi Tammy, how are you?
Tammy Le:
I'm good. Thank you for having me today.
Sheila Bella:
Oh my gosh. So you and I have put this in the books months ago.
Tammy Le:
Months ago. It's been a while. We've both been so busy so we finally have time to sit down and do this podcast together, so I'm very excited.
Sheila Bella:
I'm so excited too. I guess, would you say a lot of people on Instagram know you as Face Amor ... Amor by Tammy, but they know you as the permanent makeup artist with the red hair? The Asian permanent makeup artist with red hair.
Tammy Le:
Yeah, I'm easily recognizable because of my red hair. I've had this ever since I actually started doing PMU, so people just know me as Tammy has the red hair. It's really funny.
Sheila Bella:
I mean, it's beautiful.
Tammy Le:
Oh, thank you.
Sheila Bella:
I'm tempted. Every time I creep on your page, I'm like, "I wonder if I could rock that."
Tammy Le:
Girl, I love your blonde hair. Not a lot of people can get it that blonde either, so ...
Sheila Bella:
Oh, thank you. Thank you. I have help obviously.
Tammy Le:
Me too, me too.
Sheila Bella:
That's so funny. Yeah, so I was just telling her before we pressed record that what's going to be really great about this recording, it's going to be a really authentic "get to know" because you and I haven't had a chance to sit down and get to know each other although we wanted to. So, yeah, this is going to be kind of like you guys eavesdropping on our girl talk, our conversation, our first date.
Tammy Le:
Our first date. Don't you feel like we kind of already know each other though just from Instagram and just talking back and forth? It's crazy how social media is nowadays.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, I think it's really awesome. You know what's crazy is I have hangout dates with my friends. Like for example we're going to hang out tomorrow, but the people that I talk to the most are my permanent makeup friends who most of them I've never even really met in person or just texting and FaceTiming and stuff like that all day long, all day long. And it's people that ... it's crazy. I didn't go to school with them or anything like that, but they're my tribe. You guys are my tribe. When I need to bounce ideas off of somebody, who do I call? I call my tribe, you guys, and vice versa.
Tammy Le:
Yeah, it's definitely an amazing community that we have and I'm glad everyone can come together and share ideas and not feel like they don't want to share their knowledge with everybody because it's very important to. I definitely love that.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, most of the time. Most of the time it's-
Tammy Le:
Most of the time, most of the time.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, and even just being able to say "most of the time," I think is such a blessing.
Tammy Le:
It's true. Yeah it is, considering how many people are in this industry.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, yeah, and how competitive sometimes it can be, but I just want to focus on the good because there is so much good. There's so much good in this industry and sometimes when you have one bad experience or one negative experience and one negative person from anybody listening, if you're disheartened by it right now, look around. Chin up, look around, because there's definitely more good than there is bad. Don't let that one negative person or experience taint you from all of the joy there is in our industry, right?
Tammy Le:
Yeah, and it's just part of life. There's always that pulse that goes around the path to your goals, is like a rollercoaster. Just because you've had one bad experience doesn't mean all of them are going to be bad.
Sheila Bella:
I know.
Tammy Le:
You're always going to have ups and downs.
Sheila Bella:
It is up and down.
Tammy Le:
Yeah, it is so up and down.
Sheila Bella:
It's so up and down, and I remember when I first started in this industry, I didn't know that, you know? One of the things in my talk for the summit is going to be "I didn't sign up for this." This is not what I signed up for and I feel like, yeah, from day one when you have that bushy, bright-eyed ... that idea, that first idea, it feels really good. You think you're going to conquer the world. You think it's never going to feel bad. You can't imagine it ever going bad and then the very next day or immediately after, maybe when you have your first bad Yelp review or something like that or maybe somebody in the industry betrays you or an employee messes up, yeah, your world is crumbling, and immediately say, "Oh my God, this is not what I signed up for," but nobody told me to expect it.
Tammy Le:
Exactly, and it's always going to be an ongoing thing. People think, "Oh, after five years it's going to be easy after this," but you're always learning something new every single day.
Sheila Bella:
So now you've been in the industry for 13 years.
Tammy Le:
Yes.
Sheila Bella:
So, most people I think would look at you and think, "Oh my gosh, that's where I want to be." I'm so curious, what is challenging you right now being Amor by Tammy and Face Amor? This empire that you've built. What is the challenge for you at this stage? What can we expect?
Tammy Le:
Honestly right now my studio is only two years old, so my challenges right now is trying to manage a studio and a group of girls, and there's so many things every day that you have to kind of manage, that it's really hard, especially when you're a mother and you're a wife and I just find it ... the balance of it is really challenging to me, and trying to make everything work.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, I can totally relate. So tell us about your family life. How many kids do you have? You have a [crosstalk 00:21:06] right?
Tammy Le:
I only have one. Yeah, he's seven years old. He's my little piece of gold, and yeah, we are super close. I always put him first so that's why I've been balancing my hours to reflect that. I don't work as much anymore as I used to so I think that's also a challenge for myself and my client, but I'm very grateful for the clients who do understand that.
Sheila Bella:
That's awesome. Yeah, and for any moms out there, I feel like, yeah, I guess if you're a mom and you're trying to run a business at the same time and you're not stressed out, it means you're not trying to be a good mom.
Tammy Le:
Exactly.
Sheila Bella:
So if you're stressed out, that's a good sign. Yeah, you can sit with us.
Tammy Le:
No bad moms, but try a little harder.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah. It's stressful because ... and don't you find that there's a lot of mom guilt? That's something too that I get asked about a ton.
Tammy Le:
I wanted to ask you that today, because you are just nonstop, always energetic. I have a tenth of your energy, I'm going to be honest. I feel bad about being on my phone when we're together, trying to check messages. Being on social media, that's like another full-time job.
Sheila Bella:
[crosstalk 00:22:23]
Tammy Le:
I don't know how you do it.
Sheila Bella:
Do you run your own social media?
Tammy Le:
I do.
Sheila Bella:
Okay, everything. Everything.
Tammy Le:
Everything, even the Face Amor one. The Face Amor one, Michelle, my business partner actually helps me post but I create those posts.
Sheila Bella:
I see. Wow. Yeah, it's a full-time job. So, I have my answer for how I deal with mom guilt. I don't know if it's a good one but I have an answer.
Tammy Le:
Would love to know it.
Sheila Bella:
This week in particular, this week in particular has been very stressful for me. Not necessarily stressful but busy. Really busy. There's a lot of deadlines. I'm speaking in Cancun next week, so events coming up. Right before we hit record, I just told you, "We're sold out, we're sold out!"
Tammy Le:
Right, yes.
Sheila Bella:
Right? And so there's a lot of moving parts, and this week, every single night ... What is it? It's Friday. I've been working late every single night, but the thing is-
Tammy Le:
Yeah, and I talked to you last night and you were still working and I told you, "Stop working. Go to sleep."
Sheila Bella:
I was in this chair. I was in this chair.
Tammy Le:
You still are.
Sheila Bella:
I know, I'm back in this chair. But I'll tell you something though. I had to play Tetris with my schedule, but yeah, like I said, this week I've been feeling detached. Do you ever feel that way, like when you're working so [crosstalk 00:23:52]
Tammy Le:
All the time.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, you're like ... I'm like, "Oh my gosh. I'm detached. I'm detached from the kids," and then what I do is I just keep looking forward to the day that I did set aside for them, which is this evening I set aside for them and Sunday I set aside for them. Tomorrow night I set aside for my husband.
Tammy Le:
Oh that's good. Yes, yeah.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, so I just keep thinking, "Okay. It's okay. Friday night, Sunday," and then I just keep thinking, "Okay, after these two months is over and the event is over and it's onto a new project, then it'll be different," and it typically is. But yeah, there is a sacrifice, and you do have to choose. I wish I could tell people listening, and this is why I said I'm not sure if I have a great answer, but I'll teach you how to manage it. I wish I could tell you that you didn't have to choose. You can have it all. You can have it all. You can't have it all. I have a live-in nanny. I have a live-in nanny.
Tammy Le:
Okay.
Sheila Bella:
I don't even want to call her a nanny because she means so much to me, you know what I mean?
Tammy Le:
She's part of the family now?
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, no, I don't even call her that. So Lynn, she's like my sister, right? She's like my sister mom, my sister wife, and she's the behind the scenes hero. When you look at my face, you're looking at Lynn. [crosstalk 00:25:16] Lashes on [crosstalk 00:25:18]
Tammy Le:
Because you have two kids, right?
Sheila Bella:
I have two kids.
Tammy Le:
Yeah, yeah.
Sheila Bella:
And yeah, this job, even before I got super busy, this job, just being a mom, just comes with guilt. It's like built in, because I guess that's for good reason because it's for safety, the safety of your child, right?
Tammy Le:
Right, exactly.
Sheila Bella:
But yeah, I just think that you have to choose. You do have to choose, and there's ways you can manage it, and how I manage it is just being very strict with my time, being very strict with my time. I make sure that I put my kids to bed every night, I at least read them a story every night and I pray with them and I tuck them in, and then I take them to school. I'm the one that takes them to school, so we have that time too and then we have our Sunday or sometimes during the week I'll take one of the boys out on a Mama and Beau date or Mama and Gray date or something like that and I'll bond with them, but yeah, you do have to choose and it's just a matter of priority.
Tammy Le:
Yeah. I learned that actually within the last year after opening my business. My son would be like, "Can you come on a field trip with me?" And field trips-
Sheila Bella:
Oh my God.
Tammy Le:
They tell you a month ahead of time and my schedule is booked three months ahead of time and you can't move those clients that have been waiting to come in to see you.
Sheila Bella:
No you can't.
Tammy Le:
So yeah, I made it a point to tell the teacher, "Look, you need to let me know a year ahead of time when all these field trips are so I can block off my schedule." I want to do those things for him. I don't want him to miss out just because I'm working all the time.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, yeah. I do that too. So, tell me when all these freaking performances are. You and I were just talking right now, like, "There's an assembly on Friday." I'm like, "We have an assembly too."
Tammy Le:
Exactly, yeah.
Sheila Bella:
And nothing happens at these assemblies.
Tammy Le:
I know, I know. Today my son had a presentation though so I was glad I was there for that. But usually nothing really does [crosstalk 00:27:24]
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, no, usually nothing happens, and sometimes I ask the teacher, too, I was like, "Can you tell me if he's getting an award or if they're [crosstalk 00:27:31]"
Tammy Le:
Yeah.
Sheila Bella:
Because if not, I'm out.
Tammy Le:
Yeah, exactly.
Sheila Bella:
I got to go. That's so funny. I think it's really crazy how you're in Canada, you're super far away and I'm in LA. Our lives are the same.
Tammy Le:
Basically they are the same. Different countries but the same lives.
Sheila Bella:
That's hilarious. Okay, well I want you to tell me a little bit more about you and how you got here. What was your childhood like?
Tammy Le:
So I grew up in Edmonton, Alberta. For those of you don't know, that's somewhere in Canada in the west side. I grew up actually going to Catholic school but I'm not Catholic, but learned a lot of values from that and then after high school I honestly knew I didn't want to go on to university because there was nothing that I knew I wanted to be. My family had a nail salon and I was like, "You know what? I am going to take aesthetics and help them," because I thought that would just be the way to go. And I took aesthetics-
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, like a good little Asian would do.
Tammy Le:
Yeah. My mom didn't enjoy that because obviously she felt she wanted more for me in life coming here from Vietnam, and she was a refugee so she had to go through a lot of hardship. So she wanted better for me. I understand that now but obviously right now she's 100% proud of me.
Sheila Bella:
Of course.
Tammy Le:
Back then to go into aesthetics, for her it was just not something that she wished for me.
Sheila Bella:
Interesting.
Tammy Le:
Yeah. I took it and I helped her for a bit but, you know what? I hated nails.
Sheila Bella:
Really?
Tammy Le:
I absolutely could not stand doing pedicures and manicures. I didn't have a love for it. I did love doing facials though. That was my passion during that time and then I ended up going into a totally different industry. I worked in tech support for six years after that, before I started my last business and my PMU business.
Sheila Bella:
Wow, so you were in the beauty industry. Then you left and then you came back.
Tammy Le:
Yes, exactly.
Sheila Bella:
Tech support.
Tammy Le:
Yeah, so I was fixing cell phones.
Sheila Bella:
Shoot me now.
Tammy Le:
I was fixing internet.
Sheila Bella:
Shoot me now.
Tammy Le:
I know, I know. So I have a lot of experience dealing with clients and customer service. So I felt like that actually helped me going into-
Sheila Bella:
Yeah.
Tammy Le:
Yeah, so there's always something that you can bring into any kind of field that you're working in.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, absolutely. I feel that way too about other jobs that I've had in the past. I'm just taking it with you. You take it with you. That's your education.
Tammy Le:
Exactly, yeah.
Sheila Bella:
That job you hated was actually your education.
Tammy Le:
It was. It made me lose a little bit of patience but I'm gaining it back slowly.
Sheila Bella:
Oh my goodness. So tell me when you first discovered permanent makeup. What was that about?
Tammy Le:
You know what? I was 16, 18. I always went back to Vietnam and my whole family has their brows done. My mom had it done for a long time. I've even watched her get her first eyebrow, eyeliner and lips done back when there was no numbing. And this was, I want to say, 15, 20 years ago. It's always intrigued me. I always loved brows. I love the art of it. So when I went back to Vietnam about seven years ago, I was like, "I want to learn everything. Eyeliner, lips, lashes, all of that."
Sheila Bella:
Give it to me.
Tammy Le:
Asia's been doing it for so long, I thought that would be the perfect place to start.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah.
Tammy Le:
Yeah, you can't go a block without seeing someone doing tattoo [inaudible 00:31:30] and it's 100% normal. I brought it back, but you know what, during that time it wasn't popular here yet. Our trends are a little bit more behind, so I started with lashes. When I was doing lashes that was kind of the trend then, and about two years after that was when people were starting to recognize the importance of the PMU industry and how easy it is to wake up on the go with this.
So yeah, I started at a good time. There was only maybe five other people doing it in the city. So they always say first to market is usually best to market and it was easier for me to build clientele that way. That's how I started.
Sheila Bella:
Oh wow. So you learned from Asia, where it was invented, by the way.
Tammy Le:
In Vietnam, yeah, in Vietnam.
Sheila Bella:
Was it invented in Vietnam?
Tammy Le:
You know what?
Sheila Bella:
That's the origin? I know it was somewhere in Asia. I don't think we've ever been able to pinpoint it.
Tammy Le:
Yeah, it could be China, it could be Vietnam, but I just know Vietnam, it's been around for so long, but in the end I feel like it was in Asia that it was invented. Us Asians don't have a lot of brows to begin with.
Sheila Bella:
Who is the person who invented that? I mean, are they rolling in their grave right now that they didn't patent this?
Tammy Le:
Right? For sure, for sure.
Sheila Bella:
I don't think we've been able to truly trace back the exact origin and person-
Tammy Le:
No, I've never seen that.
Sheila Bella:
You know what?
Tammy Le:
[crosstalk 00:33:10] We can trace it back to ancient times honestly, when they started body tattooing. I'm pretty sure it had to do with everything else that has led to today's techniques.
Sheila Bella:
Apparently Cleopatra had eyeliner.
Tammy Le:
Oh interesting, I never knew that. Wow.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah. I'm talking about microblading and the modern day PMU. If anybody out there has the answer, I feel like ... I don't know, I feel like [crosstalk 00:33:37]
Tammy Le:
We'd love to know.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah. DM us. That's so funny. I want to know ... So we talked about what's challenging you. I want to know what you're most grateful for, like really. Really right now, zero in, what are you most grateful for?
Tammy Le:
I am most grateful for my clients and everyone that I've met along the way in this industry. You guys have helped me grow. If it wasn't for my clients, I honestly ... I know people say this all the time but it's true, if you don't have clients supporting you, you can't grow. You can't learn from your mistakes. You can't evolve to be better than you were yesterday. So I am 100% grateful for everyone that I have met throughout my career and I want to say thank you for trusting me with your face.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah. I'm grateful for that too. I'm grateful for this community and I'm grateful for my clients, because your clients are your biggest teachers.
Tammy Le:
They are, 100%.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, supporters and teachers.
Tammy Le:
Yeah, and I know if you follow me on Instagram, I always have these funny quotes about not the best clients but in the end-
Sheila Bella:
Oh my God, you tag me in them.
Tammy Le:
... All my clients I'm grateful for ... Yeah.
Sheila Bella:
You tag me in them and I am laughing so hard. You've got to follow her on Instagram, you guys. Okay, Amor by Tammy. She has the best one-liners about clients.
Tammy Le:
And sometimes I feel scared. I'm like, I hope my clients don't get offended, but it's not meant to offend anybody. It's just it's what happens in our industry and sometimes clients ... some clients don't see us as a person and it's a little maybe it'll knock some sense into them.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, yeah, some people ... I've been treated that way before too, where I'm like, "You know I have a pulse, right? You know I'm not your slave, right?"
Tammy Le:
[crosstalk 00:35:45] Yeah.
Sheila Bella:
So my next question is if you really knew me, fill in the blank. If you really knew me, you would know that I ... fill in the blank. What would we know about you?
Tammy Le:
Love food.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah?
Tammy Le:
I am a foodie. If you knew me, I would ... I haven't in a while but I'm always eating. I'm always thinking about food. I'm always hungry.
Sheila Bella:
Oh, that's so funny. That's so funny. Do you have any secret dreams that you're embarrassed to share?
Tammy Le:
Secret dreams? Oh, you know what? That I'm embarrassed to share ... Why would I share it now?
Sheila Bella:
Because making you feel comfortable and it's ... It's just us. It's just us.
Tammy Le:
My secret dreams ... I don't know. I wish I was ... You know what? Sometimes I wish I was an actor or I could be, but I'm very, honestly shy in front of a camera so [crosstalk 00:36:53]
Sheila Bella:
Oh my God, you look like a superhero. You would totally be such a cool Marvel superhero in a movie.
Tammy Le:
I'm very fobby sometimes, so that's what I'm trying to be better at is my speaking skills. Sometimes I [crosstalk 00:37:08]
Sheila Bella:
Wait, did you just say you're fobby?
Tammy Le:
I did, yeah.
Sheila Bella:
I'm like [crosstalk 00:37:13] hold on, did she just say ... I've got to give you a minute, make sure you're talking about that, like fresh off the boat. Fresh off the boat.
Tammy Le:
Yes. If you've seen me with my black hair eight years ago, you would be like, "Hey, that's fobby, Tammy." That's what I'm known as before was my black hair. Fobby Tammy.
Sheila Bella:
Oh my gosh. Fobby Tammy. Were you born in Vietnam?
Tammy Le:
I wasn't. My mom was a refugee so she fled to Malaysia and I was born in Malaysia.
Sheila Bella:
Oh. Okay, you were born in ... and how old were you when you came here or when you came to [crosstalk 00:37:46]
Tammy Le:
I was two years old so I basically grew up here my whole life.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, yeah. Okay. I'm an immigrant too. I came here when I was eight.
Tammy Le:
Oh wow.
Sheila Bella:
So I'm legit ESL.
Tammy Le:
Yeah. You don't sound it though.
Sheila Bella:
Oh thanks.
Tammy Le:
But if we were-
Sheila Bella:
But if we were what?
Tammy Le:
If we were to have a conversation constantly together, it would bring out my fobbiness. I would say words that my friends are always laughing, like that did not make sense at all. I'm just like, oh my gosh.
Sheila Bella:
Who are your closest friends?
Tammy Le:
My closest friends, have been best friends with since ... like 15 years now. We have this group of girls that we travel together with. We make it a habit to at least spend one day together with a month.
Sheila Bella:
Oh that's so nice.
Tammy Le:
Yeah, you live in the same city but it doesn't mean you can see each other every day. People grow up, they have kids, they have their own lives. So one trip a year.
Sheila Bella:
Oh that's great. That's awesome. My best friends are the people I work with. I don't like saying "working for" actually. Like, "Oh, they work for me." I like saying "with". I feel like it's more accurate in the way it feels.
Tammy Le:
It is accurate.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, honestly. So yeah, so we have that. We have group retreats.
Tammy Le:
Oh yes, we're trying to start to do that within our company. I feel like it's so fundamental to building relationships with each other when you're working with them.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, absolutely. Don't you think relationship is the key? When people say, "Oh, how do you manage all these girls?" And just like what you were talking about, sometimes there is drama, you know what I mean? And sometimes there are high emotions. How do you manage all that? My response to that is just relationship. Relationship, relationship, relationship. You have to really invest in people. There's now around it. I feel like the question a lot of people have is basically how do I avoid pain? And my answer is you can't.
Tammy Le:
You can't, yeah.
Sheila Bella:
You have to risk.
Tammy Le:
Yeah.
Sheila Bella:
Okay, I'm glad we're on the same [crosstalk 00:40:01]
Tammy Le:
I think, number one for me is communication. We have this group chat. I'm always telling the girls whatever you need to get out there, just let us know. Don't be afraid. Don't be afraid to talk to us. We are pretty outgoing in that way and every few months we try to have a breakfast together or have a dinner for all the staff. We've become a family because most of the girls that have started with me have started since the beginning, that we open the studio. So we have grew together a lot.
Sheila Bella:
That's awesome. In terms of that, have you had any people that have worked for you that no longer do?
Tammy Le:
Yes, I do, yes.
Sheila Bella:
Okay. Tell us what you can about that, about those relationships.
Tammy Le:
Because we don't have such a big revolving door yet ... So there's only a couple girls that have left our studio and, you know what? It's hard. It's hard when you're first starting off and it's my first time managing girls. The communication wasn't there and the communication led to some mistrust, I would say, and unfortunately it resulted in having to let some people go. But I learned a lot from it. That's why now I make sure I'm on the point with everything and I talk to my girls and how they're feeling because everyone feels so differently. You might think that they're okay, but really, they're not. Whether it's pay, pay is huge, how you pay them. That's always, I feel, the number one issue, and then fairness. You have to treat everybody fair.
Sheila Bella:
What else did you learn specifically from managing your business and managing people? Is there a-
Tammy Le:
You can't make everybody happy.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah.
Tammy Le:
That's all I can say. You can't. There's no way. You can try to, but you just can't.
Sheila Bella:
I'm still learning that.
Tammy Le:
Yes, yeah.
Sheila Bella:
I'm a recovering people pleaser. Sometimes, don't you find yourself falling back into that pattern? Like, "Why can't I do it?" Because we get in this groove, like, "Oh, everyone's happy with me," and then all of a sudden they're not, and then you're like, "Dang it, dang it, wait, what?" And then when those feelings come up again, I'm like, "I thought I was over this. I've done my therapy already." I think it's a constant thing that you have to coach yourself to push forward through. Yeah, you just cannot. You cannot please every single person no matter how hard you try, no matter how ethical you're being, no matter how much you communicate or how fair you're being.
Tammy Le:
I think it's human nature. I think we always want more and, like I said, communication is so key, so that ... yeah, if you're not communicating with them, they're just not going to be happy and I feel like as humans, we always remember the bad things more than the good things that were done for us.
Sheila Bella:
So true. Yeah, our body remembers it. It never forgets.
Tammy Le:
Yeah, it does. So the 10 good things we've done for people, they'll remember the one bad thing that you did to them. That's always going to be a struggle.
Sheila Bella:
Why is that? Maybe it's a protection thing.
Tammy Le:
I think so, yeah.
Sheila Bella:
That's crazy. Yeah, and I think it takes time to unlearn these behaviors, right? Or these patterns that we've built, especially when it comes to people. If you've been burned once really badly, all of a sudden something small that somebody tells you brings up those feelings, brings up those feelings of ... we project, right? We punish other people for something they didn't do, something somebody else did in the past, and we punish-
Tammy Le:
It's unfair. It's unfair, but it's something personally I think the person has to deal with themselves. You've got to recognize what you're dealing with and why we feel that way. Not everyone's going to treat you the same way.
Sheila Bella:
Absolutely, absolutely. Okay, couple more questions. What are your strengths? What are your strengths? And in particular, what are the strengths building your business has developed in you that maybe you didn't have before?
Tammy Le:
Communication. In the beginning I told you-
Sheila Bella:
[crosstalk 00:45:13]
Tammy Le:
Yeah. I'm very shy. I never like to do presentations. I'm an educator, but put a camera in front of me and I'm just shaky. I forget my words, I stumble, but being an educator, talking to more of my students, my clients, I've been able to build communication with people. Before, I would sit next to someone and just don't talk to me please, and now it's like, "Hey, how's your day? Good morning, good afternoon." Just being more inviting and I think that's something that you need to be welcoming with in order to have more positive people in your life. The way you project your feelings is the way people will feel about you.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I've learned that too. Believe it or not, I felt like ... I was really socially awkward before I built my business. Aside from just awkward, the biggest thing was I was socially unaware of other people's feelings and their patterns and ... But now I feel like I read through people, or read people like a book pretty clearly.
Tammy Le:
Sometimes you just have to sit back and watch and listen sometimes to really acknowledge them because we can get so worked up in ourselves. It's really easy to do.
Sheila Bella:
Absolutely. If you were to give yourself, Tammy Le, 13 years ago, advice, what would you tell her?
Tammy Le:
You know what? Just quality and consistency. I find that back then I would always be thinking of ... I had so much goals. I had so much ideas and then I just watched people put out these ideas that I was like, "I thought about that a year ago. Why didn't I just do it?" And then kind of felt like I fell behind. So if I could talk to myself 13 years ago, I would just be like, "Get off your butt and just go for it, don't be scared." That's how I would have learned. But now I'm learning, slowly. 13 years later.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah. Go into the storm. Go towards the storm.
Tammy Le:
Yeah, go towards it.
Sheila Bella:
Oh, that's awesome. And your best advice for how to live a Pretty Rich life?
Tammy Le:
How to live a Pretty Rich life? Live it the way you want it. Do what makes you happy. Like I said, I truly believe the energy and vibe you put out to the world, it will come back to you in richer. Positive thoughts always yield positive results and even when it doesn't, don't let it get you down. It's just a learning curve. Be happy with what you have instead of worrying about what you don't have. And I think that's what a lot of people struggle with is they see this influencer or this PMU artist has this many followers and they're like, "I need that to be-"
Sheila Bella:
Legitimate.
Tammy Le:
Yeah, to feel legitimate or to feel a certain way about themselves. Build relationships in your network. As much as I thought that I could do this all by myself, you know what? You can't. You need your friends. You need people who work with you. You need the support of the community to live a Pretty Rich life.
Sheila Bella:
Love it. So full of gems, and how can we find you, Tammy? And how can we work with you? Tell [crosstalk 00:48:56]
Tammy Le:
At Amor by Tammy. Look for the red hair.
Sheila Bella:
I'll put the link in the show notes too. Link to your Instagram.
Tammy Le:
Yes, and we have a website as well, www.face-amor.com. We have online classes on there and-
Sheila Bella:
That's awesome.
Tammy Le:
... PMU supplies.
Sheila Bella:
That's great.
Tammy Le:
Yeah, thank you for having me today. It was lovely chatting with you again.
Sheila Bella:
I'm totally going to check it out. I'm going to check out everything. I'm going to dive in and stalk you a little harder.
Tammy Le:
And I will see you in March.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah, I'm so excited.
Tammy Le:
For whoever is going.
Sheila Bella:
Yeah.
Tammy Le:
Yeah, I'm so excited too.
Sheila Bella:
Thank you so much. Thank you so much, Tammy.
Tammy Le:
Thanks Sheila.
Sheila Bella:
Okay, I'll talk to you later.
Tammy Le:
You have a good day. Have a good week.
Sheila Bella:
That's it for today's episode of Pretty Rich Podcast. If there was anything in this episode that has impacted you in any small or big way, I want to know. You can reach me at Real Sheila Bella on Instagram, and by the way, if we are not text buddies yet, that needs to change. You can text my name, Sheila, S-H-E-I-L-A to 31996 and we'll be connected. I really love hanging with you guys on here, and one last thing before we wrap it up, I've got to include my kids, right? Hashtag mom first. So here are Beau and Gray to close things out.
Beau:
Hi, my name is Beau and I'm five years old.
Sheila Bella:
Can you tell everybody what our family motto is?
Beau:
I can do hard things.
Sheila Bella:
I can do hard things. Now fill in the blanks. Hard is ...
Beau:
Fun.
Sheila Bella:
Easy is ...
Beau:
Boring.
Sheila Bella:
Good job, buddy. I love you so much.
Beau:
I love you the best more infinity. [inaudible 00:50:46]
Sheila Bella:
Gray, say "share with your friends."
Gray:
Share with friends.
Sheila Bella:
Please review my mommy on iTunes.
Gray:
[inaudible 00:50:54] iTunes.
Sheila Bella:
Thanks for listening.
Gray:
Thanks for listening.
